Suspension setup guidelines

[Wormsworld]

Just a link to an excellent suspension article my friend shared w/ me.
http://www.sasbk.co.za/suspension_setup_guidelines.htm
Perhaps we could get a list of articles started and sticky it since it seems to be a common question.
Out fiddling w/ my rebound setting, Worm

And another http://www.sportrider.com/tech/motor...ion/index.html

[arkie6]

http://www.peterverdonedesigns.com/suspension.htm

Lots of good suspension related info and links with more links along the left side of that page.

I've used this particular page several times when changing fork oil and determining the proper viscosity to use:

http://www.peterverdonedesigns.com/lowspeed.htm

[Falcon 269]

Another useful guide with plenty of explanation about how suspension works:

http://www.gostar-racing.com/club/mo...ion_set-up.htm

[Wormsworld]

Could someone post the link to the suspension worksheet? Someone has it in their sig I think. Thanks

[sportryder]

Copied from this thread - http://www.yamahafz1oa.com/forum/showthread.php?t=92195

I sat down a couple of times this weekend and started to participate in this thread. There is so much to write down and I figured it wouldn't be productive to state my opinions. I see that others have posted some things here and I'm glad of that. I agree with what has been said 100 percent. Using tire wear and what you think might be causing that wear should be the way to set up your suspension. In my experience, tire wear displays more of how the rider rides his/her bike than how the suspension is set up. Also, there is no perfect suspension setup for all conditions.

When I do a baseline setup on a motorcycle there are two things I believe to be the most important since they are the basis for everything that follows. Those two things are sag and then front to rear balance. Some suspension tuners look only at dynamic or "rider aboard" sag but they do not compare those numbers with static sag to determine if they truely have the right springs under them. There are some variables to consider when looking at your sag numbers also.

It's possible to set up a bike with the wrong springs so the dynamic sag numbers are inside the ballpark. However, when you set up a bike based solely on dynamic sag, you might find your static sag numbers are totally wacked out. Here's an example - you might increase spring preload on the fork springs and shock spring so your dynamic sag numbers are somewhere between 35 and 40mm. You might think that is ok. Then, you measure your static sag numbers and find you have 12mm of static sag in the forks and 0 (zero) static sag out back on the shock. This is a classic indication of over-preloaded the front and rear springs which may cause the suspension to "top-out" too hard during a series of quick "S" turns. This isn't good. The bike might also have poor front to rear balance. Also not good for optimum handlng.

So with suspension setup, everything really starts with getting the proper springs under you. Once that mission is accomplished, you can then sort out damping adjustments.

Generally with a revalved and resprung set of forks, I like to set the compression damping first. I will start with a middle setting on the compression adjuster and leave it like that until I ride the bike over my "test" road. After a few test rides, I might turn the compression adjuster in for less movement of the forks over bad sections of road, or I might turn the adjuster out to soften the forks to improve bump compliance. Compression damping adjustments are based more on rider preferences and the typical road surface conditions a rider might see during his daily riding. I personally do not believe in using compression damping to control front fork dive. You can do that if you want, but you might find your bump compliance is suffering simply because you have tried to eliminate or reduce fork dive by using the compression adjuster. The correct solution might be to go with stiffer fork springs.

I like to set the rebound damping by bouncing the front forks while observing how they function when they are extending. For a race-bike at the track, we do not like to see the forks extend so quickly that they overshoot and pass their at rest position and then settle back down a substantial amount. We want the forks to extend moderately quickly but not pass their at rest position. Depending on the track or the rider, the forks might be best set so they ever so slightly pass their at rest position and then settle a couple of mm. This might be ok for that rider at some tracks.

For riding on the street, forks that are set up like the racetrack settings may not work as well as they possibly could because the extra rebound damping would cause the forks to extend too slowly for street use. The bike may ride fairly well and the rider may really like that extra bit of control during spirited riding, but the front tire may start wearing in an odd way. A compromise needs to be made. The cause of the odd wear is caused by a combination of riding style and widely varied road surface conditions. Guys that tend to ride at a very elevated pace on the street may find they need the extra control provided by more rebound damping. The solution??? Compromise with your riding style and possibly the rebound damping so the forks respond slightly quicker during the majority of your aggressive riding.

Trail braking to the apex and then rolling on the throttle from the apex to the corner exit might cause your front and rear tires to scallop around the tread grooves. Changing rebound damping may reduce these traits slightly but changing your riding habits could nearly eliminate this odd wear.

Mark and I had a discussion about this very same thing a couple of weeks ago. His solution and I agree with him is to maximize braking
but minimize it while leaned over. This includes engine braking. I asked him how he did that and he described how he maintained some throttle input while leaned over and while braking at the same time. Most of his hardest braking was done before the bike was leaned over. A lot of this technique
boils down to corner speed selection and knowing how much grip your tires ultimately have while leaned over.

For the rear shock, compression damping adjustment is made for bump compliance and "squat" during hard acceleration and rebound damping is used for the feeling of wheel control after the bump. Generally, use enough rebound damping so the back suspension will extend quickly enough yet not feel loose or floaty. Sometimes, as odd as it may sound, you can add compression damping to prevent the shock from overstroking which compresses the spring further into its stiffer or hasher zone. Depending on the bumps you are crossing over, this might be a better solution vs softening the compression adjustment. Using too much rebound damping will prevent the shock from extending quickly enough to be ready for the next bump. It could also have the shock operating much of the time in the stiffer zone of the compressed spring. It will actually make the shock feel like the spring is far too stiff. Balancing the compression and rebound damping on the shock is sometimes the most difficult thing for the novice to do while adjusting the suspension.

Now, with all of this said, I'm sure others have more to add. Mr "Tire Killer" Mark Byrd has things to share I'm sure...

[sportryder]

Originally Posted by VA_rider

... One more question though... a lot of folks recommend changing settings 1 click at a time, and going from there... I think it would be hard to notice 1 click of change at a time, especially when going back to back with the changes... would it be acceptable to write down the current settings, and then go multiple clicks higher/lower, write down findings and then work in smaller increments? or is the 1 click at a time the method to use?

with the Soqi Gen1 FZ1 forks, the adjuster screws have a .5 thread pitch and 8 clicks/detents per revolution. The adjuster isn't making much of a change in needle height with a one click change. You might be riding up and down that road many times before you really notice a change in your damping settings. I would try as a minimum, 2 clicks. If you don't notice a difference at two clicks, try 4 clicks. The point is to make a change of the adjuster noticeable enough to allow you to discern without a doubt if it is better or worse. You don't want to be guessing at this point.

I agree with what Mike wrote above regarding minimum damping in order to maintain control. This is a wise statement.

Suspension damping is supposed to help control wheel velocity up or down. When the wheel and tire combination rolls over a bump or a dip in the pavement, it must move rapidly up or down so contact with the pavement surface is maintained. It should not be allowed to move so rapidly that kinetic energy takes over and it should not prevent movement of the wheel in tracking the surface. This is extremely difficult to achieve in the real world on all pavement surface conditions. The laws of physics just don't allow it for all conditions when there are heavy objects that must move or stop quickly. I believe this is why tires will sometimes show odd wear when ridden on the street aggressively even after the suspension has been upgraded and dialed in well. The tire is being "used" to its maximum potential. The tire is also the first component in the suspension "equation". It flexes (moves up and down) and has its own damping characteristics too due to its construction.

What we search for is a single setting we can live with for the majority of our riding needs. It won't be perfect for all of the different roads or surfaces we might encounter, but we might be able to live with it. What amazes me still is how it feels when the suspension is working perfectly for many of the pavement conditions I see on a ride.

I'll never forget a moment I had my first year at Traxxion. I had recently upgraded the suspension on my '02 FZ1 and had it with me while we were at Daytona working at the track. I was riding my FZ1 to Leesburg to visit my family after spending the day at the track. I was tired and it was dark. There was a "Y" in the road and I couldn't make up my mind if I would veer right on 44B or continue on straight. Well, I didn't reduce speed enough to make the right and I didn't stay on the road and continue straight. I kind of went onto the shoulder of the road, rode up and in line with an old concrete curb that was there and then off the curb at the end and into the dirt of the shoulder and eventually back onto the pavement surface. I had to pull over soon to collect myself cause it could have turned out much differently at 50-60 mph! My knees had turned to jello and my heart was racing. Here I was, out in the country, in the dark and little to no traffic on the road at all. What was remarkable was how the front and rear suspension just kind of floated up onto the dirt and concrete curbing with no bump energy being transmitted to the chassis at all. I don't know how much of this was luck and how much of it was the suspension upgrades. All I know is how incredible it was that there was no jolt or bump energy transmitted although I could see that there should have been something. From that day on, I knew I would never have stock suspension on my bikes for very long.

[MARK BYRD]

Lee, that is alot of great info I want to thank you for everyone. The only thing I will add is everyone need to learn to not be afraid to play with the bike setup. I have learn alot by changing thing and riding the bike hard and find I like or dislike the new changes. So bikes like difference setup. Some people riding habits like difference setup too. So guys and gals get yourselfs some good suspension EVERYONE can benefit from good suspension setup.

[Alley Oop]

Originally Posted by Wormsworld

Could someone post the link to the suspension worksheet? Someone has it in their sig I think. Thanks

The link to the suspension worksheet is in my sig and also listed in the tech tips in the upper right of the board.

[KBay84]

Great info, thanks all

[REDFAZER03]

Hey guys. After a year & a half riding this moto I decided to check where the forks are adjusted. The lower was 12 clicks out & the upper was 16 clicks out. Now I weigh 220 pounds in the shower so I would call this "marshmallow" set-up. I set the lower to 6 clicks out, it was too harsh. Increased to 9 clicks out - great. Then I set the upper to 8 clicks out. Wow what a difference. Apart from the new rear coil spring I haven't played with that yet. Man what a difference. Most of the Thai guys are pretty light & my setting would be way too harsh for them but for me it is excellent. I can see tire wear increasing as now I'll be able to push more to the limit & that limit has been increased. If there was another thread for this - sorry. Just wanted to write it down while it's fresh in my mind.

[briars]

FYI

http://aprilia.rsvmille.home.comcast...sion_guide.htm

This is a very good guide. Perhaps the best I have seen.

[kentwis]

I 'm installing gold valves on my 03 fz1.following the Clymer manual i noticed a mistake on page 356 regarding #17 where it says install the oil stopper....this step should happen before putting the inner fork into the outer fork other wise the bottom cartridge bolt [# 20] can not reach the bottom of the cartridge. Plus I don't have any place in the bottom of the outer fork where the stopper engages to keep from rotating (pg 356 step 18) .Maybe I'm getting paranoid now but isn't picture 26 on pg 351 the opposite of how it should be ? This being the top out spring what is it topping out on. It seems to me that if it were directed up to the top of the cartridge it would bottom out on the raised ridge on the bottom of the inner fork and fulfill it's function of stopping the inner fork from bottoming out. Straighten me out here guys Asap if possible so I can wrap this up.