Here is the evidence, the frame can break

[Bibendum]

Originally Posted by CAPT-KEVLAR

Seems a little silly to me.

Pardon me if my English is no good or caused misunderstanding.

My dear Capt-Kelvar, which part is seems silly to you? Worry that i may get kill or the retrofit service? Can show me the light?

I ride a FZ-1S 2007. I love this bike, quick response and good enough for me this novice to the 1000cc class. I have put in some money onto her since i bought her (Which i seldom put money too much for me to bear on other of my bikes). The crack frame issue really makes me concern. I am not coward of death, but please, with a good cause. There are alot of other FZ riders around the world, Europe, US & Asia. Even if there are only 0.5% of the frame work is problematic (let say 25 out of 5000 produced 06 - 07 models), then chance is there that some of these cracked frame riders maybe our fellow forum users here.

I have heard people rode his FZ during some riding trip when one side of the frame just gave way and bike went listed. Later found a hair line crack on the frame welding point. He was lucky that he did not crash and handicapped himself. Of course, this was a hear-say, no solid picture nor was beside him during the incident. I have never heard crack frame issue so LOUD other than Gen 2 FZ1.

As for the retrofit or recovery work, i think Yamaha should at least do something to bring back the faith of their loyal supporters. I do not say bad thing about Yam. I am working in metal trade and i know sometimes there are sure have some defect on welding work. It is how can we salvage the issue.

The solutions are clear. Solve the existing problem, or leave the problem alone by changing other makes which crack weldment is least (put aside high speed like over 100mph crashes).

I wish all fellow FZ riders ride safe and have good trips with all potential nightmares over soon.

Cheers.

[Dek]

Chrunchie
I apologise if my little joke to Padre upset you. I can quite understand your sensitivity. I wish you a speedy recovery.

Bibendum
You make some valid points. However you must understand the scepticism shown by some of us who have owned our gen2's troublefree (re: frame) for over 2 years, and especially others who have put theirs to the ultimate test, i.e. crashed, without the frame welds showing any visible signs of failure. My feeling is that if mine was faulty it would have shown by now. I therefore don't worry. Having said that, it's now clear that certain frames should not have been passed by Yam's quality control system. The evergrowing list of broken frames and/or accidents cannot be ignored. Maybe time for Yamaha to commission some NDT on those welds.

Dek

[Bibendum]

Of course Dek and surely my both hands raised in agreement with you.

NOT all FZ will have or have this frame work issue now or in the future. As you can see what i have posted regarding that small little percentage of crack frames issues i hope Yamaha can give the end users that very least assurance that they will arrest this problem for current users and future FZ's lovers.

But surely, i do not wish myself to be one of those defectives frame owner. But who will know till the 'LOTTERY' striking. My side have already few defective frame issues and i hope they can have good deals work out with beloved YAM.

[mac 1]

Originally Posted by Aleon

It only fellover and was found with that might damage to the frame? Come on, look at the fairing, tank and the bar ends........he layed this over and crashed........

I am reall y still blown away by the frame damage.........

^^

Yeah that bike went down hard, however it's good to hear yami is steping up to the plate, I think every crack (the 2 or 3 i've heard of) has come from some kind of crash or hard fall, this is still not exceptable I wheelie all the time and carry more wait then recomended and have had no problems, lucky or time is just ticking not sure, seem's like the one's that did crack are found to have poor welds, for $9,000 + I would hope yami could do better, however so far so good for me nearing 2 yrs & 7k + miles

[mac 1]

Apparently Suzuki is being sued by several people as well they wreck there bike or it falls over and the frame breaks, here's a 2006 GSXR 1000

[Dek]

But surely, i do not wish myself to be one of those defectives frame owner. But who will know till the 'LOTTERY' striking

Bibendum, you are obviously concerned so why not take the initiative and get your frame examined by an expert. Surely preferable to exposing yourself to unnecessary worry or potential injury.

[Bibendum]

Yes, maybe i should. At least to ease my concerns. Not so sure if they can detect weaken welds which without physical cracks.

Thank you Dek for your advise.

[mac 1]

IMO, I think allot of folks that post up complaining about the frames weather it be Yami/Suzuki etc. have no Insurance and are looking to get a new bike, there is at least for me a reasonable amount of damage to expect if I or someone was to crash at any speed, however I could see a frame cracking in a wreck of 35/40 + mph, if I even drooped my bike I would most likely not want it any more, look at an automobile wreck at 40 mph it can do upwards of $10,000 in damage
However I can see a weld machine producing a bad weld after so many welds and needs adjustments, if the machine isn't getting adjusted before it's needed then that is totally UNACCEPTABLE.

[Jariva]

Well the Italian bike seems to have been crashed pretty hard. A gentle low speed drop would not break the engine mount. With these light, high tech frames certain type of collisions will do damage to the frame, even at low speeds.

You drop the bike hard, frame cracks, insurance pays. In case of no insurance, you blame Yamaha for bad welding and bad design. And the other posted bike with broken frame was in an accident as well (before or after a frame crack, who knows?).

A heavy, tubular frame will bend in a crash. The new type cast aluminum frames will crack. It is that simple. In either case, the frame needs to be replaced.

I do not worry about frame cracks, I worry about speed traps and riding the bike beyond my skills.

[Padre]

Originally Posted by Jariva

Well the Italian bike seems to have been crashed pretty hard. A gentle low speed drop would not break the engine mount. With these light, high tech frames certain type of collisions will do damage to the frame, even at low speeds.

You drop the bike hard, frame cracks, insurance pays. In case of no insurance, you blame Yamaha for bad welding and bad design. And the other posted bike with broken frame was in an accident as well (before or after a frame crack, who knows?).

A heavy, tubular frame will bend in a crash. The new type cast aluminum frames will crack. It is that simple. In either case, the frame needs to be replaced.

I do not worry about frame cracks, I worry about speed traps and riding the bike beyond my skills.

Let´s forget the order of the crash and frame crack. Have anybody seen such a framedamaga, where welding is OK and the frame has damaged somewhere else.
As far as I remember from teknical gollege, the welding must be planned and carry out so, that it is as strong as the parts beside or stronger.

I can´t accept it that the framewelding in some kind of a fuse.

[Bibendum]

IMO, Ride recklessly without using that little peanut in head... crash and crack up the frame....Yamaha should not bear any responsibility, it is not fair for them.

But if frame shows signs of material fatigue under normal usage (by the way, what is NORMAL usgae in your definetion?) & is due to Yam's poor quality control. Then Yam should bear the responsiblity. Cost of repair or in terms of totalling the bike and injuries (death or handicap) due to this type of poor quality control. The i wish my FZ not to have this kind of welding works...

Pics borrowed from the other frame issue thread here.

[stan_lemieux]

Bibendum,

What are we looking at in your posted pictures? Thin welds?
Ça devrait pas comme ça?

[Bibendum]

Originally Posted by stan_lemieux

Bibendum,

What are we looking at in your posted pictures? Thin welds?
Ça devrait pas comme ça?

Sorry, i am not a professional welder. My eyes & ears are not trained to see the weldings. But for sure, the 2 weldings are not of the same alikes should be.

The top weld seems to be thin and you can see there is something like a thinner weld line on the joint. irregularities found if to compare to both pictures and if they are on the same frame.

Check out the link here to see further.
http://www.yamahafz1oa.com/forum/sho...t=69625&page=8

[chrunchie]

@DEK
Everything is ok, i am on a good way. The accident was in 07/2006. The tragedy is that yamaha said that it happens because i make the mistake. Altough the question is why break the frame and looks like the other frame they didn't have a crash like ft1980http

[Padre]

My frameproblem is finally in order. After röntgenpics they suggested that they change the chassis to a 08-model chassis as a warrenty. Now it´s been done and she is at home again.
Well done Padre ;^)

[kimiko]

Originally Posted by Padre

My frameproblem is finally in order. After röntgenpics they suggested that they change the chassis to a 08-model chassis as a warrenty. Now it´s been done and she is at home again.
Well done Padre ;^)

Hello, I sent you an e-mail, please you can reply thanks

[DaveG]

Should we track the frame numbers or plant/manufacture locations of the problem frames?

[Alley Oop]

Originally Posted by Padre

My frameproblem is finally in order. After röntgenpics they suggested that they change the chassis to a 08-model chassis as a warrenty. Now it´s been done and she is at home again.
Well done Padre ;^)

I'm glad that you were able to resolve your problem, Padre.

I think that many of us have seen pictures of small cracks developing on otherwise undamaged bikes, which I think indicates a manufacturing problem.

[TheRepairMan]

I'll say it again ...you gotta check and re-torque those motor mount and/or frame slider bolts.

The engine on a gen 2 is, by design, a "stressed member"of the chassis. The integrity of the frame casting and welds depend highly upon the rigidity of the engine's mounting, so it absolutely must be secured properly. Keeping all the fasteners tight is a shared responsibility of the owner as well as Yamaha.

Please don't reply otherwise and make me a stressed member of this forum!

Actually, by posting this information I'm hoping to help members from having this type of frame failure. I'm NOT a Yamaha rep. nor do I have any explanation or conclusion as to why some frames have broken. I am just simply stating what I know to be true about these frame designs.

Roger

[briars]

I agree, to a degree with TheRepairMan. The torque is very important and I have said it many times that the frame sliders must have a steel or aluminum insert in order to maintain a set torque.

But two "apx" 3/8 diameter bolts (no time to check the manual for metric size) torqued to 37 ft lbs and attached at a 90 deg angle, are a very week link to the "stressed member". I know there are 2 more bolts with nuts used as motor mounts. One around midpoint of the frame and the other just inches below it above the peg. I dont think they are the problem because THEY DONT HAVE A WELD BETWEEN THEM. But you do want to maintain them at proper torque.

Step back and look at the frames, it is basically a wishbone with a weld at the apex and is connected at either side of that apex. It doesnt take a brain surgeon to figure out where it will break.

I would much prefer a tiangulated frame, which weighs 10-15 lbs more, to the current one. (I have plenty of extra weight I can loose)

The bottom line is in the race to make the lightest bikes, the frame integrity has suffered. It is not just yamaha, every manufacture who produces aluminium frames has had problems on various models. The one really good aluminium frame I know of is the Honda 600 F4I most of the stunters are using them because they are triangulated in the very area where the FZ1 need to be.

Give me some good old fashioned steel and if the damn thing breaks and is out of warranty I can weld the SOB myself!!!

Question to SELF, how did you get drawn in to this again?

It really makes no difference at this point to anyone that has the bike or is going to buy one. It is still one hell of a lot of bike for the money and is a blast to ride. Give it hell, have fun, be safe and if the thing breaks get it fixed and go like hell again.

From someone who has been there.
Love & Peace OUT