2006 FZ-1 Dyno charts - Restricted HP

[Ivan]

If there was a race between the 2 bikes and the shifting was done at redline.... the new bike would win.... there is an additional 10 hp or so that the new one has over the old one.
(this is assuming that both bikes are completly stock)

Anywhere below 10,000 rpm.... and the old bike makes more hp, But the old bike is also heavier.


Ivan

[spectda]

Ivan-I am looking foward to your helping us with these issues. I really hope that we can get the FI delay worked out so that we can have smooth throttle control. Although I would take more, the power is not a big deal for me, even if another bike might stomp my ass.

[trenchtractor]

Originally Posted by Ivan

The Suzuki system does not affect full throttle operation as far as HP is concerned.

It does affect part throttle operation, and on some models, a lower rev-limit in top gear.
------------------------------------------------

The Yamaha system is quite different, and is the first of it's type.



Ivan

What I was getting at with my comment is that a manufacturer will use very similar systems between machines because it saves developing new ones. Theory being, implimentation of R6/FZ1 solution should be extremely similar (between the two bikes)... Just like the solution for the differing suzuki models is similar (over several suzuki models). Engineers at each firm being lazy, it's a lot easier to draw up one circuit and adapt it to different bikes than to start from fresh on each model. I guess the point being that hopefully the one plug and play solution can be adapted to the different models yamaha produces, and the likelyhood that future models will use the same technique as this years FZ1/R6.

Sorry if it sounded like I was simplifying our (your) problem... ;) More trying to infer that the solution would suit more than just our bike... Probably don't need to tell you that, though.

[Falcon 269]

Originally Posted by Ivan

Why would people not believe what I have shown here?

Ivan

All sorts of reasons, Ivan ... and none of them to do with not trusting you or your talents and experience.

Don't feel offended at having your posts challenged, feel flattered that folks regard you so highly that they seek to expand their understanding through questioning you

There's people and then there's sheeple ...



Mike

[Desmo]

Why would people not believe what I have shown here?

Im not questioning the numbers shown, Im just curious to
see what a head to head comparison would look like.

[Dek]

As a matter of interest I,ve found a dyno printout of my 02 which had a dj kit.
It shows the bhp for 1st-5th gears.
1st 117.5
2nd 125
3rd 128
4th 129
5th 130
Proves nothing of course.

I will say though I,ve said all along that the 06 is restricted in 1st.

[Bruce Bohannon]

I predicted in my first ride report (Mar 06) here the 06 was limited in first gear. I did not remotely need a dyno to make this assertion. I thought other gears were ok and liked third....

More testing...Compared to a slightly modded gen 1 mostly favorable.. Then my mule changed it's tires to a smaller and lighter pair and the comparisons changed substantially.

I wasn't surprised to see / nor argued with the first published dyno chart (Rider Mag/ Motorcycle Consumer News?) saying the 06 was way down on peak torque. Chalked that up to shorter stroke.

I've been professing the 06 is a solid platform for upgrading but will be expensive to sort (2G's) as well. Thought seriously about letting it go and taking my lump... as opposed to spending the 2K for engine/ exhaust tuning (only).

Earlier this week I rode the Ozark Mountains in AR and had the opportunity to experience the off/on above 4k. Very fast curves - I thought (think) the Cush Drive was toast at 2K miles. I found the 06 extremely competent in power (and frame) but it never got me into a troubled spot power wise, was laughing in my helmet at times. (Felt safe - guess the neuter is working as designed.) No surprises other than the freight train Cush Drive.

Still, my biggest dissapointments with the 06 are the seat and lack of storage. I'm still undecided about the 2K investment - but this confirmation is GREAT News to me #AND# will make my decision easier for the Yamaha.

I have purchased numerous jet kits, tre's, a jet kit and pipe combo from Ivan. For the 06 - I've also not bought a pc3 at the lowest price I could find because I would rather give Ivan my business for the package and allow him to make that contribution to his profit and overhead when the time is right.

(Bohannon 'Beliefs' - Ivan invented the TRE for the Hayabusa. If he would have patened that he would have made a MINT! Instead he was first to market solving that problem / satisfying customers. Subsequently folks took the idea and modified it for their use/ manaufacture/ profit. Point 1 - When it comes time to reward him for the R&D please don't squabble about $10. Point 2? - Ivan got his bike almost 4 months after they were available to the masses and he is breaking this news. Not that he is the end all / be all... but the information he is sharing is very substantial.)

It seems some of our members seem ready for the fix. Thanks for the info and efforts Ivan! I'm looking forward to more results.

Presumably you don't even have the manaufactured full exhausts (Ak, Muzzy, Yosh) you really would like to have at this point do you? Sorry for questions when you really need to be working. Thanks

[zenbiker]

Originally Posted by Bruce Bohannon

I have purchased numerous jet kits, tre's, a jet kit and pipe combo from Ivan. For the 06 - I've also not bought a pc3 at the lowest price I could find because I would rather give Ivan my business for the package and allow him to make that contribution to his profit and overhead when the time is right.

(Bohannon 'Beliefs' - Ivan invented the TRE for the Hayabusa. If he would have patened that he would have made a MINT! Instead he was first to market solving that problem / satisfying customers. Subsequently folks took the idea and modified it for their use/ manaufacture/ profit. Point 1 - When it comes time to reward him for the R&D please don't squabble about $10. Point 2? - Ivan got his bike almost 4 months after they were available to the masses and he is breaking this news. Not that he is the end all / be all... but the information he is sharing is very substantial.)

It seems some of our members seem ready for the fix. Thanks for the info and efforts Ivan! I'm looking forward to more results.

Let me echo this sentiment. I've only just become aware of Ivan and his prowess; rest assured I'll gladly pay his price for his fixes as just reward for his investment of time and money.

[pgmjsd]

Originally Posted by zenbiker

Let me echo this sentiment. I've only just become aware of Ivan and his prowess; rest assured I'll gladly pay his price for his fixes as just reward for his investment of time and money.

I got Ivan's kit + full system + airbox mod + AIS for my '01 FZ1 two years ago. The price was well worth it as the bike was transformed. This time I'm not going to wait as long (3 years) to get a well engineered system from Ivan.

[roadrage]

IVAN
I don't think anyone is or will question your ability or findings,AS for ME, I am
chopping at the bit for you to find a decent resulution to the problems
I know you wont stop until its right, THEN we can buy what ever and have the PERFORMANCE yama should have gave us. so keep at it and hook us up.
PLEASE

[JeFFZ1]

Originally Posted by spectda

Ivan-I am looking foward to your helping us with these issues. I really hope that we can get the FI delay worked out so that we can have smooth throttle control. Although I would take more, the power is not a big deal for me, even if another bike might stomp my ass.

Smooth throttle control and more power.I expect nothin less. After all its Ivan!

[Alpha Wolf]

Lars,

I have done dyno testing on cars but not bikes and while we usually only paid attention to high gear results, the variation in peak power between gears was very small.

I think Ivan has seen enough motorcycle dyno charts to be able to tell the difference between slippage and efficiency loss differences between gears and large differences due to some other thing going on. 11hp?
On a bike that is significant!

[Ivan]

Here is where it's at currently.....

Part of the midrange improvement is electronic and part of it is a slip-on with removed CATS and mapping. airbox and filter is still stock and will stay that way until I find everything thats hidden.

I will not share any info about the electronic stuff...

Both dyno runs are 4th gear #2 is appx 70 degrees and #27 is in the mid 80 degrees.... so actual improvements are slightly greater than the charts show.


Ivan

[medburd]

Originally Posted by Ivan

Here is where it's at currently.....

Part of the midrange improvement is electronic and part of it is a slip-on with removed CATS and mapping. airbox and filter is still stock and will stay that way until I find everything thats hidden.

I will not share any info about the electronic stuff...

Both dyno runs are 4th gear #2 is appx 70 degrees and #27 is in the mid 80 degrees.... so actual improvements are slightly greater than the charts show.


Ivan

Ivan,

Those are some pretty hefty improvements regardless of what your doing to it without getting into the guts of the bike. If you don't mind me asking what slip on are you using for these runs. It seems you have found some of that midrange that Mama Yama was bragging about in their advertisement. Have you taken it for a spin with the improvements and what is your take on the power delivery now? thanks for the work, it is impressive!

medburd

[BlackT5]

The real question is how much of the gain was slip on and mapping and how much was eletronic? Anyway those are some inmpressive gains.

[Alley Oop]

Originally Posted by Ivan

there is an additional 10 hp or so that the new one has over the old one.

Thanks for posting.

I'm confused on the point above. The way I read it, the old vs. new chart shows only a 2.3hp max power difference. Where's the 10hp?

Keep in mind I know nothing about dynos.

[BAE 557]

Ivan,

The HP/TQ numbers are looking real good, thanks for all your hard work. Does this mean that the package is becoming real close to being released?

-William

[Ivan]

Originally Posted by Alley Oop

Thanks for posting.

I'm confused on the point above. The way I read it, the old vs. new chart shows only a 2.3hp max power difference. Where's the 10hp?

Keep in mind I know nothing about dynos.

If you look at the old vs new chart.....you will see in the 10-12,000 rpm range, there is a major difference between the 2...

If there were a drag race, the midrange gain that the old bike has is only for 1 gear.... after that the shifts would be at redline, and there would be an advantage in the new bike's favor.... but for overall use, the old engine makes more power everywhere in the most used ranges.
(so far... but I'm not done yet)

I am not nearly ready to release any package yet.... (sorry)

Ivan

[Alley Oop]

Originally Posted by Ivan

If you look at the old vs new chart.....you will see in the 10-12,000 rpm range, there is a major difference between the 2...

Gotcha!

[mrjcall]

Originally Posted by Ivan

If you look at the old vs new chart.....you will see in the 10-12,000 rpm range, there is a major difference between the 2...

If there were a drag race, the midrange gain that the old bike has is only for 1 gear.... after that the shifts would be at redline, and there would be an advantage in the new bike's favor.... but for overall use, the old engine makes more power everywhere in the most used ranges.
(so far... but I'm not done yet)

I am not nearly ready to release any package yet.... (sorry)

Ivan

Can you share where you are with the A/F ratios? Maybe post the graph as you did with the dyno runs above?