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Go Back   FZ1OA Message Board > FZ1 & Fazer Owners Association > Exhausts, Carburetion & Performance > Gen 1 Exhausts, Carburetion & Performance

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Old 08-05-2005, 06:17 PM   #1
ndgibbs15
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7000 RPM tach error (EXUP removed)

Bought an 03 FZ1 1 week ago. 22,000 miles, Titanium full Yosh system, Ivan's jet kit (per previous owner). Bike runs perfect... bottom end, midrange, top end... it's all good, very good.

Anyway, full system means no EXUP. Apparently I don't even have the servomotor anymore. I get the tach error... 7000 rpm for 3 seconds, then actual rpm for 3 seconds, then 0 for 3 seconds, repeat, repeat, etc.

What wires can I jumper to eliminate the 7000 rpm error? I noticed one post about it somewhere, but no details.

much grass
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Old 08-05-2005, 09:33 PM   #2
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I took note of that tidbit of info quite a while ago; thought it might be useful someday. Looks like it's today.

"to fool the error code mechanism you connect (jumper) the blk/red wire with the wht/red wire."

Hope that helps,
BR
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Old 08-06-2005, 08:04 AM   #3
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you da best!!

Thanks so much BR!!! Such a simple fix, and now have my tach back. Remove one screw, prop the tank at about 45 deg, find the EXUP connector dangling near the top front of the engine, maike a 1" jumper using speaker wire, plug into b/r and w/r terminals, apply a little black tape to secure, button it all up... I'm done!!

thanks again
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Old 08-06-2005, 09:24 AM   #4
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Are you serious?! That worked for you? I couldn't get the jumper to work for me so I bought the $100 resistor that gets rid of the error code.
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Old 08-06-2005, 10:58 AM   #5
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Serious as a heart attack. Mine's an 03, so maybe something changes in the schematic for different years. Couldn't have been simpler.
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Old 02-08-2006, 12:42 AM   #6
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Hmmm! I'll have to try this. was just thinkin about removing the servo while my frame is stripped for paint.
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Old 02-09-2006, 09:12 PM   #7
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has anyone weighed the servo? just curious...

Also, for those not able to get the jumper trick to work, how about trying a few resistors to see if that would work. Start with a high value and work your way down. From an electrical standpoint, I don't think you can simply measure the resistance of the motor and mimic that, it doesn't work that way (if I remember right, you have impedance which is a product of resistance and inductance).
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Old 02-10-2006, 01:57 AM   #8
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It might be worth doing a bit more research or giving Ivan a call.

I have a feeling that removing the servo and jumpering the wires isn't the optimum solution.

I seem to recall reading that the servo is communicating with the ECU and it has an influence on the ignition timing. No servo or unserviceable servo puts the ignition timing into a default mode.

Like I say, I'm not sure but you may want to investigate further.

Mike
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Old 02-10-2006, 04:39 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikegtx2002
I seem to recall reading that the servo is communicating with the ECU and it has an influence on the ignition timing. No servo or unserviceable servo puts the ignition timing into a default mode.
how many modes are there? i didn't realize the timing could be altered.
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Old 02-11-2006, 01:23 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fz1pone
how many modes are there? i didn't realize the timing could be altered.
It's not like the ECU blackbox has a selection of modes that you can get into and alter. I found the relevant thread here:

http://www.yamahafz1oa.com/forum/sho...xup+servo+ivan

There's a post from Ivan which includes the following:

" ... once a fault code starts, the blackbox goes into default mode (different ignition timing) and then the bike must be shut off and re-started to exit the default mode."

I'd say it's a fair bet that the default ignition timing is 'softer' than the normal map and so just jumpering the servo wires may be a less than optimum solution to this question.

Mike
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Old 02-11-2006, 08:17 AM   #11
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edumacate me here. i'm not sure i understand the term "map" in this context, as i thought ignition timing (once set) was constant through out the rev range. isn't that why Ivan and Dale argue about the advantages of timing advancers?

but i gather from what you're saying that the ecu can hold and apply a variety of ignition timing "maps" in much the same way as they can have different fueling maps on efi bikes.

but i still don't get that, because that would imply that by removing the exup servo and jumping the terminal you would alter the performance of the bike in some significant fashion - acceleration, fuel consumption, vibes, etc.

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Old 02-11-2006, 12:16 PM   #12
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OK, I'll try ...

The word 'map' was perhaps misleading if it made you think of EFI mapping, but it's not all that far out.

A typical modern ignition module advances/retards the spark according to various parameters based on throttle position, revs, gear (possibly) and others depending on the make and model of bike.

I don't know how complex or sophisticated the FZ1 ECU is but it obviously takes note of throttle position (hence TPS) and I'd guess that it notes gear and revs, too. It must also be noting some resistance values from the EXUP servo motor.

While the ECU doesn't hold a selection of maps, per se, it does have a default mode in which the stock ignition curve is altered to take account of the fact that the EXUP isn't functioning correctly.

What you've inferred about jumpering the servo motor connector having an adverse effect on performance is therefore correct.

I hope that helps ... if anyone who really understands the workings of the FZ1 ECU would care to embellish on this or correct any factual inaccuracies, I'd welcome further comments here



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Old 02-11-2006, 12:30 PM   #13
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I'm sure it's possible for the ECU to command varying ignition timing based upon engine RPM sensed, and maybe it even senses the acceleration curve (ie what is the rate of change of engine rpm... is this a soft or a hard accel). All of that and more is possible I'm sure, and it's even possible that the timing is modified automatically when a fault code occurs. I truly don't know if Yamaha went to that trouble or not.

Here's my experience though. I bought my fizzy used, and it already had the full Yosh exhaust. The servo had been removed, so whenever the bike was running it would display the 7k fault code via the tach needle. The bike ran like no tomorrow... still does. Previous owner was not a FZ1OA member, so didnt' know about the wealth of knowledge here. I posted the fault here, some kind soul told me how to install the jumper, and I did so. Didn't change the performance at all, zip, none, nada, and the tach started working like it should. If I leave the ignition key on for about 15 seconds without the motor running, the fault code reappears. I turn the igntiion off, back on, and of course if I start the motor the code doesn't pop up.

I have had absolutely no problems with the servo removed and the jumper installed. The bike is way scary fast and smooth as a turbine thanks to Ivans MB jet kit, and the recent inlet boot porting I had him do.

Ivan offers an electronic device that simulates the servo (check his website). You can use that with no worries I'm sure, but you've got to pay for it.
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Old 02-11-2006, 02:27 PM   #14
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Time for someone to call Ivan, methinks

I'd prefer if one of you guys would do it, 'cos Transatlantic calls are a little more expensive

Mike
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Old 02-11-2006, 03:39 PM   #15
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After installing the Muzzy, i removed the EXUP cables but left the servo intact.
The servo weighs very little and the savings would not be felt by the mortal man, spending $100 to shave a pound or two is outta the question to me....the ECU still see's the EXUP servo but it doesn't serve a function other than to fool the ECU.
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Old 02-11-2006, 04:00 PM   #16
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Hello all,
I ran across this on the UK Locost builders site:
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/view....php?tid=36976

I've gathered the components to buld one, which is about $10.00 in parts available from your local Radio Shack, and will report back on how it works. I'm sure this circuit is very similar, if not the same, as the "manufactured" units costing upwards of a $100.00


-Todd
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Old 02-11-2006, 04:49 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toddc
Hello all,
I ran across this on the UK Locost builders site:
http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/view....php?tid=36976

I've gathered the components to buld one, which is about $10.00 in parts available from your local Radio Shack, and will report back on how it works. I'm sure this circuit is very similar, if not the same, as the "manufactured" units costing upwards of a $100.00


-Todd
hmm. the folks on that board also seem to feel that for carb'd r1's (and presumably fz1's as well) if you can get rid of the constant error code there should be no more problems....
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Old 02-11-2006, 04:59 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikegtx2002
There's a post from Ivan which includes the following:

" ... once a fault code starts, the blackbox goes into default mode (different ignition timing) and then the bike must be shut off and re-started to exit the default mode."

Mike
Not sure if that's correct Mike?
Had the Exup fault code do it's song and dance for a LONG time. On rides when the fault code was presenting itself, I immediately felt the bike to be way less responsive to the throttle input.
But when the fault code disappeared again, often during the ride, everything went back to normal, that includes throttle response.....
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Old 02-12-2006, 02:15 AM   #19
Falcon 269
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Jan,

Just so anyone else reading this thread is aware, Jan is referring to real EXUP problems with the original headers, not fault codes showing when the headers have been changed and the servo removed.


What you were feeling, Jan, were the effects of the EXUP valve sticking in the wrong position. Once the valve released and started to operate correctly, you regained performance.

The slight difference in performance caused by a small ignition timing change (default mode) would be imperceptible compared to the big changes induced by the exhaust valve.

If you question the quote from Ivan still, maybe you'd like to call him, too



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