Electrics

[Mike P]

I can't find any specs on the output of the FZ1's alternator.

Any potential problems from running heated vests and other electric clothing (for 2); auxiliary lighting; radar detector; music device; etc?

[MDFazer]

I know several people that run heated clthing grips, radar detectors and even an MP3 player.

You may want to look into fuses, and I'm not sure how many devices you can run at one time.

Do a search on your topic, you may find more.

[ABH]

Accordint to the Service Manual

Charging System:
Type: AC Magneto
Model (mfg): F4T361 (Mitsubishi)
Normal output: 14V / 365Watts at 5000 RPMs
Stator coil resistance / color: 0.27 ~ 0.33 ohms at 20 deg. C (68 deg. F) / W-W

Rectifier / regulator
Regulator type: semiconductor short circuit
Model (mfg): SH650C-11 (Shindengen)
No-load regulated voltage: 14.1 ~ 14.9 volts
Rectifier capactiy: 18 amps
Withstand voltage: 200 volts

All this and other electrical specification information is in the manual on pages 2-15 thru 2-17.

You may have to do a little math to figure out the left over power with everything powered up.

[Desmo]

Any potential problems from running heated vests and other electric clothing (for 2); auxiliary lighting

Definitly a problem running that much on the FZ.

The FZ puts out a pretty wimpy amount of power. We've had a few people find out the hard way using
aux lights.

Running dual vests AND lights would be very risky IMHO. If we assume 35 watts for each vest,
and 70 watts for an extra pair of lights, you're looking at another 11 amps of current draw.
Add a 2 pairs of electric gloves @ 20 watts each, and you're up to 15 amps.

[YankTar]

Originally posted by Desmo
Any potential problems from running heated vests and other electric clothing (for 2); auxiliary lighting

Definitly a problem running that much on the FZ.

The FZ puts out a pretty wimpy amount of power. We've had a few people find out the hard way using
aux lights.

Running dual vests AND lights would be very risky IMHO. If we assume 35 watts for each vest,
and 70 watts for an extra pair of lights, you're looking at another 11 amps of current draw.
Add a 2 pairs of electric gloves @ 20 watts each, and you're up to 15 amps.

It's worse. Gerbing electric jackets take 77 watts, pants take 44 watts, gloves and socks each take 22 watts. The Widder vest is better but it still draws about 50 watts.

[Desmo]

Widders vary depending on size. 33, 35, or 48 watts. I went for the middle figure.

But yah, Gerbings really suck down the power.

[YankTar]

Originally posted by Desmo
Widders vary depending on size. 33, 35, or 48 watts. I went for the middle figure.

But yah, Gerbings really suck down the power.

Yeah, but Gerbings are awesome. Unfortunately, they were designed with BMW and 'Wing owners in mind, not FZ1 and FJR owners.

(The FJR's absolutely WORST feature is too little excess alternator capacity. It's the ONE thing you cannot fix, but must work around--You cannot even get it re-wound as you can with other alternators)

[bluenjfz1]

Ok, so I know this is an older thread but I have some questions.

I know that the FZ1's alternator output is too low. I just installed a heat troller for my Gerbing Jacket and Gloves, and when I hit the horn while riding with them on it goes: beeeeeeEEEEEEEEEPPPPPP! There is definitely a lack of power at first, and then a surge. I don't recall if that happens with and without my high-beams.

So am I doing something wrong? The heat-troller is wired directly to the battery. Am I hurting the bike's electrical system in any way by taxing it such? Is there something I can do about the alternator output at all aftermarket? Am I now limited to what I can wire into the bike? I like simplicity, but a hardwired radar detector or iPod charger down the road would be nice if I could make it happen, not to mention Hyperlights which are on my TO-DO list.

HELP!!

-Pete

[NEO]

Why not change all your running lights/turn signals/tail light to LED. WAY less draw and a good place to save power......also looks kewl!!!!

[5lv]

Originally posted by bluenjfz1
Is there something I can do about the alternator output at all aftermarket? -Pete

It would be difficult.

I tried to do just that on my Vmax, and there just wasn't room to get even the next larger size wire on the stator form. Maybe a machine could do it but I couldn't. Putting the origional size 17 gauge wire back on was hard enough. I think the FZ1 stator is considerably more compact than the Vmax so I would be very surprised if anyone could get bigger wire on there.

Add to that, I wasn't even thinking ahead about a beefier regulator and wire harness to go with the lower resistance/higher current output of the stator.

Your best attack is to reduce the electrical load in other areas if you can.

[bluenjfz1]

Originally posted by 5lv
Your best attack is to reduce the electrical load in other areas if you can.

That sounds expensive, and like a major PITA. I was going to keep this bike as stock as possible for as long as possible except for what I need to be comfortable riding long distances all year round. I was thinking of flushmounts only because they are cheap, but LEDs are probably going to be a factor of 5 or more expensive at least.

I can't imagine that in this day and age of motorcycle design I would have trouble running simple heated gear off of an alternator in a 1000cc bike. Sportbike or not, I'm a little dissappointed in this finding. Otherwise the bike kicks ass.

-Pete

[rich_in_orlando]

Here's a chart I did for this exact same question:

[NEO]

I really could have used that chart a month ago when I was building my own LEDs!!!

Better late than never, I suppose.

THANKS FOR THE CHART rich_in_orlando!!!
GREAT STUFF!!!

[timdog]

Great chart...will be useful here.

[bluenjfz1]

Ok I did some research today. All the numbers following are in volts as measured by a portable multi-meter on the battery terminals.
----------------------------------------------

No Heated Gear, engine OFF

Key Off- 12.59
Key On- 12.07
Key On/Highbeams- 12.00

No Heated Gear, engine @ 5k rpm

Low Beams- 13.2 - 13.3
High Beams- 12.48
----------------------------------------------

Gerbing Jacket on High, engine OFF

Key Off- 12.15
Key On- 11.86
Key On/Highbeams- 11.81

Gerbing Jack on High, engine at 5k rpm

Low Beams- 12.15
High Beams- 12.12
----------------------------------------------

Gerbing Jacket & Gloves on High, engine OFF

Key Off- 12.04
Key On- 11.77
Key On/Highbeams- 11.71

Gerbing Jacket & Gloves on High, engine @ 5k rpm

Low Beams- 12.02
High Beams- 11.94
--------------------------------------------------

The terminals are fine.

So is the charging system simply not enough to run the heated gear and charge the battery? How can this be? I also tested the battery again (key OFF) after everything and it was at 12.18v.

Thanks in advance!

-Pete

[bluenjfz1]

little help guys? please?

Do the above numbers show that the gear is the problem, or the stator?

[ianisme]

Voltage readings only tell a part of the story. It would be much more useful to give the current draw with and without the gear switched on. The easiest way to do this is to put your meter inline with the battery outlet. Make sure your meter is up to the current being flowed or you will be burning it out. You might also consider adding an ammeter to your normal instruments.

[rich_in_orlando]

I didn't want to reply because I wasn't absolutely sure that those voltage numbers were essentially meaningless for this discussion. Like Ian stated above, you would also need to know the current draw to determine power output. (Ohm's Law states that Power in watts equals Volts times the current in amps, or P=V*I. If we know the voltage like you measured previously, then we need amps to get the power output.)

There must be a power draw spec for that Gerbing jacket you are using. From the chart I posted above, at the worst case at 5k rpm, you have 119 watts to spare. Add up every additional electrical load you are adding to the bike. If they add up to less than 119 watts, you should be ok. If not, then you need to make some sacrifices or reduce some of the stock electrical load by changing turn signals bulbs to LEDs, etc.

I got some electrical capacity back on my bike by removing the fairing and adding a single headlight from an SV650. I then had 60 extra watts of power to play with. The heated grips I installed since then use 35 watts max, so I still have a net gain of 25 watts.

[fzwhat]

Originally posted by rich_in_orlando
Here's a chart I did for this exact same question:

Rich-

I think that you need a few more rows in your table:

Ignition power
Instrument power
EXUP servo
Minimum battery charge current

Jim

[rich_in_orlando]

I don't think ignition power would need to be added to the chart becasue the calculations are for comparison to lighting coil specs. As I understand it, ignition power comes from a separate set of stator windings and are not part of the electrical power capacity equation. In other words, I don't think the spark would run off of the battery. But tell me what those values are and I'll add them.