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Go Back   FZ1OA Message Board > FZ1 & Fazer Owners Association > General Motorcycle Discussion

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Old 04-16-2018, 09:51 AM   #21
Torchsport
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duken4evr View Post
It get it. Have been an enthusiastic dirt bike rider for decades, and for forever I thought ADV bikes were "dorky." Maybe they are, but man, they are so versatile. I won't be doing 5 Miles of Hell in Utah on my Super Tenere anytime soon, but it sure is a hoot on dirt roads, forest service roads and reasonable two track jeep trails. I have ridden my FZ1 on some of those roads, it felt very nervous and out of it's element, the S10 just bombs down them, and then it turns around and can go a distances that would make my butt explode on the FZ1. The longer travel suspension provides a cush ride on crappy roads, the sit up dirt bike riding position feels natural, comfy and commanding. With the suspension sag set correctly via stiffer springs, and with it's narrow tires, the big girl actually is great fun on a canyon road, steering lightly and accurately, and making frost heaves that rattle me around a bit on the FZ1 almost completely unnoticeable.

My small group of middle aged buddies made a pact to go on a tour every year, cuz we are not getting any younger you know. I bought my Tenere as a "tool" to do the job of going on one big tour a year, and doing lots of exploring around Colorado. It was a rational purchase; I really did not plan on falling in love with the thing. How can one love a big heavy bike that does not have a ton of horsepower? Funny about that. I really enjoy the Tenere. It reminds me of my diesel powered pickup truck. It is all about the low end torque, and cruising. I struggle not to ride wheelies, wind it up to 12,000 RPM and go 130 mph every time I ride the FZ1. With the Super T, doing that stuff not even an option The FZ1 is classic hard rock, the ST is reggae. Both are enjoyable. Funny with the ST though, turn off the traction control on a dirt road and it is easy and predictably breaks the rear end loose and steps it out, it's engine feeling like world's biggest smoothest single. Fooling around with the rear end traction on dirt roads is great sporting fun, and I can't do that on the FZ1. I actually see guys using the big KTM 1290s as a dirt bike, riding the same trails I ride on my TE300. That seems a bit crazy to me - the 1290 is a big expensive bike, but they are truly awesome machines and capable of it in the right demented hands

Here is my '14 Super Tenere, AKA "The Stealth Bomber". All ready for this summer's "mid life crisis tour" with my buddies. There is something about these ADV bikes. They can tour, but they with their longer suspension, can go off pavement easily and deal with bumps that would cause a "normal" street bike to have issues. Caveat, short people got no reason to buy an ADV bike. My ST here is as tall as my dirt bike, and fully fueled (6.1 gallon tank, 53 mpg average post ECU flash - it can cover some ground) weighs around 600 pounds. That felt insane at first, but you get used to it. Now my FZ1 feels more like the small, light and very fast bike that it has always been, which is fun.

Sharp eyes will note it has a Penske shock. It also has 1.0 fork springs in the forks (may do Race Tech gold valves) a flashed ECU to remove Yamaha's nannies, and an RS4 exhaust can to unleash the sweet 270 degree twin sound a bit. In my world, even the big pigs get modded.

The 8K purchase price which included the exhaust, crash bars, and skid plate. All in as you see it here, with the Brooks bags, used Penske twin clicker, ECU flash, new tires and other odds and ends, I have just shy of 10K in it. Not bad for what it is, the S10 can be a great used bike buy if you find the right one
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Old 04-16-2018, 11:00 AM   #22
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My buddy owns both, multi is better suited for mainly street, ktm mainly dirt roads. Really depends on what you want out the bike. I rode with him on the multi, he said its the best bike he has ridden/owned, and he is a motorcycle magazine editor. I couldnt loose him in the mountains on my fz.
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Old 04-16-2018, 12:21 PM   #23
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I hear nightmares about both KTM and Duc.... but as of late, I've been hearing less nightmares from KTM, and the same from Duc. Also, when I'm not hearing nightmares, I'm hearing passionate praises for both vehicles.
Having never ridden either, and never going to afford either, I vote the KTM! I think it'd be less of a headache, and more fun.
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Old 04-16-2018, 01:06 PM   #24
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I had a FJR at the time and everything I didn’t like about the FJR was built in to the S10.
Could you expand on this statement? Just curious, since the two bikes are so different.
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Old 04-16-2018, 02:01 PM   #25
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I've got buddies who have the KTM, the Duc, and the S10. For fun factor, you'd be pressed to find a better bike than the KTM. That being said, Jeff's KTM has got to be one of the worst bike he's ever owned...and that includes an AMF Harley, lol. Seriously, there's always something going on with that bike. My buddy who has the S10 just rides and rides and rides. It's not the fastest, but fast enough to have fun on. It's not the most dirt capable, but capable enough to have fun on. It's not the best for two up riding, but capable enough to have fun on. The S10's owner is probably one of the most negligent owners I've ever met. But despite being neglected, the S10 runs and runs and runs. If I were looking for a new bike, and I may be next summer, the S10 will be it.
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Old 04-16-2018, 02:33 PM   #26
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I've got buddies who have the KTM, the Duc, and the S10. For fun factor, you'd be pressed to find a better bike than the KTM. That being said, Jeff's KTM has got to be one of the worst bike he's ever owned...and that includes an AMF Harley, lol. Seriously, there's always something going on with that bike. My buddy who has the S10 just rides and rides and rides. It's not the fastest, but fast enough to have fun on. It's not the most dirt capable, but capable enough to have fun on. It's not the best for two up riding, but capable enough to have fun on. The S10's owner is probably one of the most negligent owners I've ever met. But despite being neglected, the S10 runs and runs and runs. If I were looking for a new bike, and I may be next summer, the S10 will be it.
The S10 is known to be utterly bombproof. There is a guy, Paul Pelland, who is out to ride 1M miles on his S10s "chasing the cure" for his MS. His 1st S10 is on display in the Barber MC Museum, it has 186K on it and sounds like it received little in the way of care, ridden hard and put away wet as they say.

https://www.longhaulpaul.com/

The great buy in price and the reliability sealed it for me. What surprises me, as I mentioned in my prior diatribe is how much I actually enjoy riding it.
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Old 04-16-2018, 02:47 PM   #27
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Could you expand on this statement? Just curious, since the two bikes are so different.
They are. The FJR was a bike that I wanted to love. Mine was a '08, black. The motor felt almost electric - It didn't pull like a FZ- you know, you start off low and the power builds up, then you hit that magic spot on the RPM and the bike tries to get out from under you.... The FJR didn't have that at all. It just pulled and pulled and pulled - not a wave of power, but a force... IDK how to explain it. On the highway, that motor was amazing but on the back roads I felt like I was missing something - anyway, if someone said they thought the FJR was the best Sport Touring bike on the road, I wouldn't disagree. All the wonderful things you read about it are true.

But mainly the FJR just didn't fit me - I mean ergonomically. The bend in the bars made my hands fall asleep. I tried moving the bars forward and backwards in the mounts, but I always had issues with it. The seat didn't fit my butt either. To wide. I put a Sargent on it within a couple of weeks, then a Corbin, then back to the Sargent. Then I shaved off some of the stock foam. I never got it right.

Anyway, I only had a demo ride on the S-10... it's power felt almost the same with the power delivery. The switch gear was the same, the bar bend didn't fit me, and... I'm sorry, but that gauge cluster is ugly as hell. No offense to anyone, none of that makes a bad bike, that's all personal to me.
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Old 04-16-2018, 02:50 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duken4evr View Post
The S10 is known to be utterly bombproof. There is a guy, Paul Pelland, who is out to ride 1M miles on his S10s "chasing the cure" for his MS. His 1st S10 is on display in the Barber MC Museum, it has 186K on it and sounds like it received little in the way of care, ridden hard and put away wet as they say.

https://www.longhaulpaul.com/

The great buy in price and the reliability sealed it for me. What surprises me, as I mentioned in my prior diatribe is how much I actually enjoy riding it.
Hey, I met that guy at the ADV/Moto rally in West Virginia a couple of years ago. I listened to his presentation and checked out the bike.
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Old 04-16-2018, 03:36 PM   #29
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Thanks for the response.
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Old 04-16-2018, 08:27 PM   #30
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Wet Head boxer - People this ugly thing is a joy to ride. It carries it weight so low that it's amazing how easy it is to handel. The Wet head is free revving to, not like the old tractor feeling of the oil head or air head boxers at all. The torsion from the longitudinal boxer is very mild.

But the power falls off pretty fast in the high end. The transmission's awesome "Positive engagement" at low RPM's is a bitch to shift when the power is on. It's also got a very long stroke at the lever. Good for heavy ADV boots, not so nice in street boots.

And the new hydriodic assist clutch - nice easy pull. Good in traffic. But I've never gotten used to the way the engagement zone widdens at the level the more RPM the motor is turning. And the linked brakes are way to biases on the rear end. The teliver front is also one of those things that is both amazing and crap. The way it eliminates brake dive keeps the bike very planted and it's very easy to ride it fast in the twistys. But it's also pretty vague feeling and that makes it hard to judge grip.

Anyway, I guess my point is that the BMW is a awesome machine for covering large distances. It carries a passenger and all the luggage in the world. And it's perfectly happy on the Interstate, a canyon road or jeep tracks. But - step things up a notch happy - from happy to exciting - and the BMW started to fall short.
The amazing Telelever. You have mentioned innovative and crap, it would be a deal breaker for me because there is no feel at leaned over sportbike condition. Having my ass handed to me on the dragon....twice, by some old GS rider I know it can be done but I need two fat 57mm poles attached to a triple clamp. Withdraw the GS unless you can live with it.
The BMW hydro clutch is the best, attaching it to a clunky '16 RS tranny is cruel but the speed snicker works perfect. A comfy GS with RS fuel maps and real forks would not sell, the crowd that uses 25 HP to ride a $28,000 650 pound spoke tire bike down gravel side roads would not have it.
The XR has all the good stuff, only 530 pounds but seems huge when ridden.

I read so many KTM horror stories, knowing that many are racking up millions of reliable miles I would be the guy investing lots of cash and dream time in the few that fail or fall short of expectation. I ride, if a bike needs dealer attention for tweaks and firmware updates it won't work for me.
You should get one, the engine should be experienced at least once they say.

Don't glace at the Ducati facia or look into those sexy LED eyes, the dang thing is just fabulous to look at.

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Old 04-17-2018, 04:55 AM   #31
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Your S10 prayers have been answered in the classifieds http://yamahafz1oa.com/forum/showthread.php?t=145343
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Old 04-17-2018, 06:24 AM   #32
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I just bought a 1090 Adv R for an even easier time off road. While my wife isn't really interested in riding pillion currently, on a quick trip around local roads, she found it very comfortable, other than the knobby tires.

I think the SA is a terrific bike and while very big, it doesn't feel as huge as the new Multi. My vote would be with the Katoom and it's 8500 mi oil changes and stout suspension. BTW, they can currently be had with crazy rebates and accessory options if you finance through KTM. I got $1500 off, plus a $500 accessory gift card from a demo day, plus another $1500 in accessories for financing through KTM with .99% APR for 60 mos!!! Get outta here with that deal!
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Old 04-17-2018, 10:48 AM   #33
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Yeah, Cycle Trader has a new 2017 SAR listed for $15,500 .... settling on my new house Friday. We'll see how much I have left over.
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Old 04-17-2018, 12:27 PM   #34
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As much as I love my 2016 SA, my BMW R1200RT was a much better long distance touring bike - its not even close. As was previously mentioned the telelever fork was uncanny at allowing a fully loaded bike track sharp corners and entry’s that were, well too hot...
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Old 04-20-2018, 09:13 AM   #35
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I hear nightmares about both KTM and Duc.... but as of late, I've been hearing less nightmares from KTM, and the same from Duc. Also, when I'm not hearing nightmares, I'm hearing passionate praises for both vehicles.
Well said. Both brands are a gamble. I've fixed or replaced just about everything on my 2012 Multistrada with 33K miles on it. At this point, I know every square millimeter of that bike like the back of my hand and lots of tricks on how to keep it running and out of the shop. (Like just disconnecting and reconnecting the negative battery terminal to fix the electronic suspension that failed last week. If I didn't know that trick, I'd be looking at a couple of grand to replace a perfectly good part.) I also have a small warehouse of extra parts that are known to fail.

That said, I still love the damn thing. It's still the most comfortable, fastest, torquiest, can-carry-the mostiest, fanciest, panacheiest, roariest, etc, etc bike I've ever owned. Even non-riders rave about it whenever I pull up somewhere.

But it is not a brand for the faint of heart, it will break down on you at some point, and I doubt I would ever buy another one. In fact, that's one of the reasons I keep it. Just knowing that I'll probably never own another Ducati.

I would only go the Ducati or KTM route if you are fully prepared to play the game.

Otherwise, wait for the Yamaha MT-10 SP that is quickly moving up my ever changing Next Bike short list.
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